Christian Hate Group Terrorizes Amarillo Texas

Calling themselves "Repent Amarillo" a group of self-identified "Christians" connected with Raven Ministries has organized a Militia Group which has been going around town stalking and harassing "Sinners" (i.e. Gays, Muslims, Swingers, Liberals) as shown in the following video.



Please note, no one in this club even if you may find it a bit skeevy is breaking any laws ("consenting adults") yet they've been stalked and outed - some have even lost their jobs due to "Repent Amarillo".

Bet if they made this Club an ABC Reality Show, these guy would eat it up!

The most disturbing thing about this group is their self-proclaimed "Army of God" moniker, besides the fact their already is a group called Army of God who are directly connected to various bombings of gay clubs (including the Atlanta Olympic Park bombing) and shootings of OB/GYN's (like Dr. George Tiller), the term actually translate into - wait for it - Hezbollah.

In addition to their stalking of the Swingers Club, "Repent Amarillo" has also gone to lengths to have a play about Gay people during Nazi Germany completely shutdown. Via Thinkprogress

Repent has struck with some success at many of its enemies within the town. A community theater attempted to open “Bent,” a play about the persecution of homosexuals during Nazi Germany. But the day before opening night, Repent members helped shut down the play by calling in fire marshals to complain about the theater’s permit. Staffers at a nature preserve were featured on local news defending themselves against Repent accusations that their site represents something related to witchcraft.

Witchcraft? Witchcraft?! Seriously, Witchcraft?

Do these guys even know that Harry Potter is just a Movie? (Clearly these guys don't READ!)

If they did read it's obvious these guys don't seem to be reading from the same bible the rest of us have been reading. Seems to me, if you're going to call yourself "Christian" - you should be paying attention to the teaching of Jesus The Christ.

If you believe Levitican law as laid down by Moses, then Adultery and Homosexuality are sins. They are Abominations:

Leviticus 18:29
For whosoever shall commit any of these abominations, even the souls that commit them shall be cut off from among their people.

Leviticus 20:13
If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them.

Leviticus 18:20
Moreover thou shalt not lie carnally with thy neighbour's wife, to defile thyself with her.

Leviticus 20:10
And the man that committeth adultery with another man's wife, even he that committeth adultery with his neighbour's wife, the adulterer and the adulteress shall surely be put to death.

You know what else is an abomination? Eating Shellfish and "Creepy" things.

Leviticus 11:10
And all that have not fins and scales in the seas, and in the rivers, of all that move in the waters, and of any living thing which is in the waters, they shall be an abomination unto you:

Leviticus 11:20
All fowls that creep, going upon all four, shall be an abomination unto you.

Leviticus 11:42
Whatsoever goeth upon the belly, and whatsoever goeth upon all four, or whatsoever hath more feet among all creeping things that creep upon the earth, them ye shall not eat; for they are an abomination.

Fortunately we have something called Refrigeration now, but what does that mean for Football Players who are constantly touching a "Pigskin"?

What else is an abomination>? Doing it with a woman, when she's got the Curse

Leviticus 20:13
And if a man shall lie with a woman having her sickness, and shall uncover her nakedness; he hath discovered her fountain, and she hath uncovered the fountain of her blood: and both of them shall be cut off from among their people.

Y'know Jesus was actually asked about these things, and most of us know what he ultimately said about Adultery. Then again may be don't.

But I say unto you, That whosoever shall put away his wife, saving for the cause of fornication, causeth her to commit adultery: and whosoever shall marry her that is divorced committeth adultery.

Get that, Divorced People getting remarried to someone else are Adulterers. Gee I hope nobody in "Repent Amarillo" has ever been divorced the way that Newt Gingrich and Karl Rove have been several times.

And what did Jesus do with Adulterers? From John 8:

3And the scribes and Pharisees brought unto him a woman taken in adultery; and when they had set her in the midst,

4They say unto him, Master, this woman was taken in adultery, in the very act.

5Now Moses in the law commanded us, that such should be stoned: but what sayest thou?

6This they said, tempting him, that they might have to accuse him. But Jesus stooped down, and with his finger wrote on the ground, as though he heard them not.

7So when they continued asking him, he lifted up himself, and said unto them, He that is without sin among you, let him first cast a stone at her.

8And again he stooped down, and wrote on the ground.

9And they which heard it, being convicted by their own conscience, went out one by one, beginning at the eldest, even unto the last: and Jesus was left alone, and the woman standing in the midst.

10When Jesus had lifted up himself, and saw none but the woman, he said unto her, Woman, where are those thine accusers? hath no man condemned thee?

11She said, No man, Lord. And Jesus said unto her, Neither do I condemn thee: go, and sin no more.

Ok, Ok, but what about Teh Ghey? Doesn't Jesus Hate Teh Ghey? Well, Maybe not according to Matthew 19

3 The Pharisees also came unto him, tempting him, and saying unto him, Is it lawful for a man to put away his wife for every cause?

4 And he answered and said unto them, Have ye not read, that he which made them at the beginning made them male and female,

5 And said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they twain shall be one flesh?

6 Wherefore they are no more twain, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder.

7 They say unto him, Why did Moses then command to give a writing of divorcement, and to put her away?

8 He saith unto them, Moses because of the hardness of your hearts suffered you to put away your wives: but from the beginning it was not so.

9 And I say unto you, Whosoever shall put away his wife, except it be for fornication, and shall marry another, committeth adultery: and whoso marrieth her which is put away doth commit adultery.

10 His disciples say unto him, If the case of the man be so with his wife, it is not good to marry.

11 But he said unto them, All men cannot receive this saying, save they to whom it is given.

12 For there are some eunuchs, which were so born from their mother's womb: and there are some eunuchs, which were made eunuchs of men: and there be eunuchs, which have made themselves eunuchs for the kingdom of heaven's sake. He that is able to receive it, let him receive it.

Here Jesus argues that Moses was WRONG to allow for divorce, and as I stated above states that anyone who marries a second time - is an adulterer. He also says people are "born eunuchs: from their mother's womb". I may be going a stretch, but that seems to suggest that some men are BORN WITHOUT AN ATTRACTION TO WOMEN.

Also I see nothing in here that condemns women who are attracted to other women. Inconsistent much? Either way, the one consistent thing in Jesus teachings was the power and value of forgiveness, not condemnation.

Luke 7:37 - And behold, a woman of the city, who was a sinner, when she learned that he was at table in the Pharisee's house, brought an alabaster flask of ointment, 38 and standing behind him at his feet, weeping, she began to wet his feet with her tears, and wiped them with the hair of her head, and kissed his feet, and anointed them with the ointment.

39 Now when the Pharisee who had invited him saw it, he said to himself, "If this man were a prophet, he would have known who and what sort of woman this is who is touching him, for she is a sinner." 40 And Jesus answering said to him, "Simon, I have something to say to you." And he answered, "What is it, Teacher?"

41 "A certain creditor had two debtors; one owed five hundred denarii, and the other fifty. 42 When they could not pay, he forgave them both. Now which of them will love him more?" 43 Simon answered, "The one, I suppose, to whom he forgave more." And he said to him, "You have judged rightly."

The bottom line is that these people aren't "Christians" at all, they don't understand the first THING about Jesus' teachings - they're merely a bunch of Thugs trying to push people around and dictate how they think other people should behave against their will.

It's despicable.

What's next tossing acid into the faces of school girls for failing to "Honour their Mother and Father?" with sassy back talk?

And it's not just in Texas where teh crazy is spreading.

A Louisiana sheriff plans to arm volunteers with shotguns, riot shields, batons, and a .50-caliber machine gun mounted on a "war wagon," as part of "Operation Exodus," a program to provide security in the event of a terrorist attack or civic unrest. "It's a calling," he says.

The office of Sheriff Larry Deen of Bossier Parish, near Shreveport in the northwest part of the state, last month selected for the program 200 local residents -- mostly ex-law-enforcement personnel -- and began training them in "defensive techniques in the event of a struggle," reports the Shreveport Times. The plan calls for the new recruits to be sent to protect food from grocery stores, gas from gas stations, and other crucial local resources, should the situation demand it.

Gee, where have I seen a bunch of armed white militant people in the middle of a Louisiana Crisis before - oh yeah, on the Streets of New Orleans during Katrina.



Just like the Anti-Government Truther Conspiracy Theorist Right-Wing Nutbag who Shot up the Pentagon Yesterday - The Militant American Taliban is real, and it is Dangerous.

Vyan

More from a Previous Diary on this.

Alan Grayson v Michele Bachmann on Health Care - To the Pain

Alan Grayson v Michele "Batcrap Crazy" Bachmann the Liar Cannon on Larry King.


It hard to believe this woman can get these lies out of her mouth as fast as she does.

Batshit: The Senate Works with 60 votes and what the President is proposing is a Nuclear Option... the Senate has to break their own tules in order to pass the bill.

No, the Senate does NOT work with 60 Votes, it completely FAILS with a 60 Vote Cloture Requirement. And the "Nuke-Lear" Option was the attempt by Republicans to Kill the Filibuster for Judicial Nominees in 2005, not the attempt to simply HAVE A VOTE on Health Care.

But then again with Alan Grayson on the case, the lie was slapped down with ease.

Grayson: My esteemed colleague from Minnesota is entirely wrong. There's nothing in the Senate Rules that prevents Reconciliation, it's been used 22 times overall and 14 times by Republicans. If it's good enough to provide tax cuts for the rich twice under Bush, it's good enough to provide Health Care for all Americans.

BOOYAA! That one's gonna sting in the morning.



As Rachel pointed out last night the $Trillion Bush Tax cuts which were passed via Reconciliation had a far greater impact on the deficit than health care will. Also we're not talking about passing the entire bill through the Senate - that's already happened with 60 Votes - the President was simply talking about passing an Amendment to the Senate Bill to make it good enough to get through the House. Exactly what can and can't be in that Amendment is where the debate lies, not in whether or not they can have an Amendment passed through Reconciliation.

King: What's wrong with the President's Plan?

Batcrap: #1 it's a job killer. #2 it's a government takeover of 18% of the economy, it'll be massive tax increase, plus it'll cut $500 Billion out of Medicare for vulnerable seniors.

#1 is Wrong, #2 is Wrong - Wrong again on #3 and WRONG! on #4.

1) According to the Business Week and the Rand Corp Rising Health Care Costs are the JOB KILLER, not Reform.

In a first-of-its-kind study, the non-profit Rand Corp linked the rapid growth in U.S. health care costs to job losses and lower output. The study, published online by the journal Health Services Research, gives weight to President Barack Obama’s dire warnings about the impact of rising costs if Congress does not enact health care reform.

2) As was pointed out by Anthony Weiner to Fox & Fiends in August, the companies that currently offer health insurance to their employees - which represents 83% of the public health insurance market - won't be able to enter the Exchange System for the first 5 Years of the program. They have to keep going as they ARE. The Government will only have an impact on the remaining 17% who are either uninsured or underinsured, even though they're working and not eligible for Medicaid.

The Government will only control the insurance plans involved in the exchange, by requiring minimum standards, prohibiting the excuse of pre-existing conditions to deny care and unreasonable claim denials. 17% is not a TAKE OVER

3) Yes, there are some tax increases to cover subsidies that will be paid for those people who still can't afford to buy the insurance offered on the Exchange, but they're not "MASSIVE" as was shown by Rachel and her chart.

4) The $500 Billion from Medicare is an estimate of Savings that will be achieved by improving quality and removing "waste, fraud and abuse." An idea that Republicans used to really like when Ronald Reagan used to talk about it. The Bills specifically prohibit the rationing of care or lowering of quality in order to achieve these savings goals, and it's not guaranteed they'll even GET those savings. If they don't the President has pledged to cut other programs in the budget to ensure this bill remains deficit neutral.

But y'know what's a little truth in the midst of all that?

King: Alan why are you for it?

Grayson: Yet again that's simply not the case. We spend 17% (NOT 18%! ed.) of our income (GDP) on Health Care, no one else in the entire world spends more than 11%, and yet we're 50 in the world on life expectancy - the japanese livemore than 5 yera longer than we do. We're 46th in infant mortality below Cuba. How can we spend so much and get so little?

I'm not sure where Grayson's getting his numbers - I have the World Health Organization Ranking the U.S. as 37th in health care, the CDC Ranking us as 30th in Infant Mortality and the UN Human Development Index ranks us at 13th in Life Expectancy - even so - Everyone says We're Number One! in costs.

Bachmann then goes on to claim that the President's plan won't "save most Americans" any money. Grayson counters that the CBO report says it will provide Health Care to 80% of those Americans who currently don't have it, and that the Harvard Study indicates that 122 Americans Die Every Day because they don't have access to Health Care. Who cares about Dead Americans when we got bills to pay?

The CBO Report Also says this...

Differences in Average Premiums Relative to Current Law due to:	Individual	Small Group	Large Group
Difference in Amount of Insurance Coverage	+27 to +30	0 to +3	Negligible
Difference in Price of a Given Amount of Insurance - Coverage for a Given Group of Enrollees	- 7 to - 10	- 1 to - 4	Negligible
Difference in Types of People with Insurance Coverage	- 7 to - 10	- 1 to +2	0 to - 3
Total Difference Before Accounting for Subsidies	+10 to +13	+1 to - 2	0 to - 3
Effect of Subsidies in Nongroup and Small Group Markets - Share of People Receiving Subsidiesd	57	12	n.a.
For People Receiving Subsidies, Difference in Average - Premiums Paid After Accounting for Subsidies	- 56 to - 59	- 8 to - 11	n.a.

83% of people in the small or large insurance groups won't see any significant change in their Health Care (because the Government doesn't "Take Over" that care) - but the remaining 17% are likely to see their costs decrease by an average of 56% once subsidies are accounted for.

That's a heckava savings.

After this Bachmann goes completely off the rails arguing that the President is making some kind of back door deal with a member of Congress in exchange for a Judgeship for that member's brother... and I love what Grayson says in return.

Bachmann: We need an Investigation! (Like the one she wanted to see if members of Congress are "Anti-American?")

Grayson: My esteemed colleague has just used a Weapon of Mass Distraction to change the subject from Health Care.

Frankly, if the President is getting seriously down to brass tacks and twisting arms in congress in order to get this deal done - i say GOOD, that's what he should be doing. That's always been how things get done in Congress. It's absolutely what Tom "The Hammer" Delay used to do when he was House Majority Leader using threats to push through the Medicare Prescription Drug Bill, which wasn't Paid for. It's not "Corruption" - it's Politics.

Overall, a nice job by Grayson.

Vyan

Anthony Weiner Takes on the Fox Liar Brigade

Rep Anthony Weiner the Congressman from Brooklyn taking on the Fox & Fools in their own Liar Hole.



It's one thing to lob bombs at them as Special Comments from a distance, it's another to get right in their face.

And the lies came fast and furious:

First the Foxers claim:

"When you put the Government Option in people are going to emigrate to that, it's cheaper and the quality isn't as good but people are going to want it..."

Fact: Under both the House and Senate Bills the Health Care Exchange would provide better quality insurance, with life-time out of pocket caps and where pre-existing conditions & unreasonable care rescissions are banned. For the most part the CBO reported that the cost difference would be Negligible for people who currently get their health care through small or large businesses.


Weiner Answered this with:

Don't we want people to have a choice? If they don't think they're getting quality, they don't want government control, they won't choose it.

Point:Weiner.

Then they claim businesses are likely to drop coverage:

What if I'm an employer, which is wear most people get their insurance - and I'm looking at the bottom line and I say I'll go to the Public Option because it's cheaper.

Weiner: That's prohibited under the plan. For the first 5 years.

All Net Three-pointer from the Wing to Weiner. That's right, Employers can't just dump coverage for cost reasons and force their workers to buy healthcare on the private market or rely on the government sysem - y'know, the way that Walmart Already Does.

Again CBO stated that 83% of the public who currently get their health insurance through their employer, will not see any significant changes in either price or quality.

Fox: But what about after those 5 years are up?

Wiener: Then those businesses will have to pay a sanction for dropping coverage.

Gretchen Foxer: After those 5 years those private offerings are going to go Bye-Bye!

Weiner: Well, why? Why are their costs higher? Let me answer that for you, because right now Insurance companies are working with about a 30% overhead and profits. Right now we're giving money to our insurance companies and we're saying give it to our doctors and their taking a piece of the action on every transaction. So why are we paying share-holders instead of people who work for us?

Tomahawk DUNK to Wiener. It's simple: if private industry can't compete on price and quality - they Deserve to go "Bye-Bye".

Foxer: Right now healthcare takes up 16% of the economy, do you really want the government controlling 20% of the economy if we bring these 22 Million additional people one

Typical Foxer looking at his own pocket and not at the fact that 20-30 Million People who don't have care - will be able to GET IT. Money? Yay! Saving Lives? Boo! Besides, with rate hikes like the kind we're getting from Wellpoint of 39% in a single year, healthcare is going to become 20%-25% of the economy if we do nothing.

Weiner: Right now 40% of all of our tax dollars are going to a Federal Funded Health Care program, Medicaid, Medicare, DOD (Tricare) and the VA. If you don't like those programs go tell Senior Citizens, go tell Michael Steele "Government funded Healthcare is so wrong". The only question here is who we're giving the money to.

The current best rated and best ranked Healthcare system in the Country isn't Cigna or Pacific Care or Wellpoint - it's TRICARE the Government Funded and Government RUN Healthcare for our soldiers and Military.

Foxer: I have bad news for you, they have done the math (On Medicare), it's going to run out.

Weiner: I agree with you, but Republicans have stood up against removing waste from Medicare.

Foxer: Well, we're not (nice of you to admit what side you're on) against removing waste, we're not "Pro-Waste".

Weiner: Republicans have put out a statement saying "Don't change anything in Medicare, including removing waste and abuse". So how are you going to control costs? You're going to have to do some things about waste.

On the money, the Republican plan is to do nothing - or worse yet when they do have a good idea, like removing waste, they turn against their own idea simply to score political points and demagogue democrats. Like Senator Bunning who was totally for spending money we don't have and against PAY GO - until last week when he all of a sudden he wasn't anymore. Putting thousands of people out of work in the middle of a recession wasn't about principle or deficit reduction - Bunning was just being An ASSHOLE, because he could.

Just think about all the Assholes you've ever known - chances are - they're Republicans.

Gretchen Foxer: Here's a problem, there's a thing called "History" and people have watched how their money has been spent by this government.

You mean like how we spent $Billions on Halliburton, KBR, Triple Canopy and Blackwater? How we spent nearly a $Trillion on the Iraq War and Tax Cuts for people who'd rather spend their money betting against American Businesses in the Stock Market than buy American Goods or providing American Jobs? Is that the kind of "Historical wasteful spending" you ment?

Nope, apparently not.

Gretchen: People are like "Holy Cow, If the government can't run Cash for Clunkers how can it run Healthcare?"

Golly Gee Willickers Pa! Pretend No-Nothing Valedictorian-Hick Dip Wad Shill Spokes Model says Wha?

Cash for Clunkers was a unmitigated success, and All of it has been PAID! Cash for clunkers has it's own Post-Mortem Site

Positive Responses: 73
Negative Responses : 103

Including:

Ashleigh says:
November 23, 2009 at 6:33 pm

i think you should do another cash for clunkers deal!!! i missed the date barley. i would’ve owned my car a year on november 3, 2009!!!!

Alessandra says:
October 10, 2009 at 12:42 am

I have an old old Honda that is hanging on by a string which means I’m driving around in an unsafe car. I was told I would not qualify because the gas milage is too good. I think it is a travesty to punish the people who have been doing what they can to keep things clean and reward those who have been polluting the environment and not really giving a damn about it. Something is just not right with how this was handle

Most of the people complaining, were annoyed that they couldn't use the program because it was limited, not that it wasn't run well or "didn't work".

Weiner: You ask people who are on Medicare whether THEY like it or not.

Foxer: It's losing money.

Weiner: Ask the people on it. Medicare Works.

Douche Foxer: Most people like it, but the fact is that doctors in hospitals aren't able to continue to exist under the rates that Medicare pays.

Weiner: So is your problem that Medicare pays too little or pays too much?

One of the changes in the Bills, and most recently in the modifications offered by the President in agreement with a "Republican Idea" - is an increase in Medicare Rates paid to doctors.

Toward the end of the clip Weiner goes on to shut down their talking points on both "Buying Across State Lines" and "Tort Reform" (two Republican ideas that don't work, but are in the Bill anyway and Republicans STILL won't support it) - and this appearance was from last August during the Height of the Tea Parties.

More recently Weiner has Called FOX out for their Orchestrated Lies.

Weiner: On programs like this there's been an enormous amount of disinformation about the Bill.

Foxer: According to you. That's what you think.

Weiner: Look, I think there's been orchestrated effort in a lot of quarters to Lie about the Bill.

Yes, they've been lying about the bill - and they're going to keep lying - I promise.

Lying is the Republican Party Template, it's their Mantra, it's the one thing THEY DO WELL - it's their THEME SONG. All you need to understand about the Tea Parties and Fox News was documented/predicted by Henry Rollins:



This is who they are, never forget it.

Vyan

What the CBO Really Said about Health Care Costs

There's a ton of argument going back and forth today about what the CBO says about the cost of the Senate Health Care proposal on insurance premiums. FOX News has particularly jumped all over this, but the facts are the following:

Read the full CBO report here.

Differences in Average Premiums Relative to Current Law Due to:	Individidual	Small Group	Large Group
Difference in Amount of Insurance Coverage	+27 to +30	0 to +3	Negligible
Difference in Price of a Given Amount of Insurance Coverage for a Given Group of Enrollees	-7 to -10	-1 to -4	Negligible
Difference in Types of People with Insurance Coverage	-7 to -10	-1 to +2	0 to -3
Total Difference Before Accounting for Subsidies	+10 to +13	+1 to -2	0 to -3
Effect of Subsidies in Nongroup and Small Group Markets Share of People Receiving Subsidiesd	57	12	n.a.
For People Receiving Subsidies, Difference in Average Premiums Paid After Accounting for Subsidies	-56 to -59	-8 to -11	n.a.

The coverage in the individual market is increased by 27 to 30% largely for people who aren't insured at all or have been blocked out by pre-existing conditions, the average costs are reduced by 7 to 10% in those various groups - and the combined difference is up 10 to 13% from what they're paying now (which for some people is Nothing) only if you Don't Include the Subsidies that are provided for in the bill. Once you include the subsidies the Savings jumps to 56%-59%.

They even put it in plain english.

Average premiums per policy in the nongroup market in 2016 would be roughly $5,800 for single policies and $15,200 for family policies under the proposal, compared with roughly $5,500 for single policies and $13,100 for family policies under current law.

Those figures indicate what enrollees would pay, on average, not accounting for the new federal subsidies. The majority of nongroup enrollees (about 57 percent) would receive subsidies via the new insurance exchanges, and those subsidies, on average, would cover nearly two-thirds of the total premium, CBO and JCT The weighted average of the differences in those amounts equals the change of 10 percent to 13 percent in the average premium per person summarized above, but the percentage increase in the average premium per policy for family policies is larger and that for single policies is smaller because the average number of people covered per family policy is estimated to increase under the proposal. The effects on the premiums paid by some individuals and families could vary significantly from the average effects on premiums.

Average premiums per policy in the nongroup market in 2016 would be roughly $5,800 for single policies and $15,200 for family policies under the proposal, compared with roughly $5,500 for single policies and $13,100 for family policies under current law.4
Those figures indicate what enrollees would pay, on average, not accounting for the new federal subsidies. The majority of nongroup enrollees (about 57 percent) would receive subsidies via the new insurance exchanges, and those subsidies, on average, would cover nearly two-thirds of the total premium, CBO and JCT The weighted average of the differences in those amounts equals the change of 10 percent to 13 percent in the average premium per person summarized above, but the percentage increase in the average premium per policy for family policies is larger and that for single policies is smaller because the average number of people covered per family policy is estimated to increase under the proposal. The effects on the premiums paid by some individuals and families could vary significantly from the average effects on premiums.

Fox and the Republicans are cherry-picking the ONE NUMBER in the entire report that shows an increase without putting it into any real context.

Vyan

Cheney & Thiessen's Terrible Torture Tales Come Tumbling Doqn

Yet again the closer we get to Cheney's dreaded "Holy Grail" memos which allegedly prove the Effectiveness of Harsh Interrogation Torture, the more those memos look like nothing more than Pyrite since what they claim simply didn't happen.

For some time, former Vice President Dick Cheney has insisted that the declassification of various CIA memos will prove once and for all that the Bush administration's torture regime was successful at keeping America safe. But as Michael Isikoff reported over the weekend, the recently-released report from the Justice Department's Office of Professional Responsibility contains disclosures that "could prove awkward for Cheney and his supporters."

More from Countdown



Transcript

OLBERMANN: Give me context for this because you were there; what
Cheney meant to the whole concept of enhanced interrogation, as they
phrased it, and what this erroneous memo meant to Cheney's role in that.

WILKERSON: I'm convinced that David Addington in Cheney's office was the brainchild of what John Yoo, Jay Bybee, Douglas Feith, Jim Haines over at Defense OSD, general counsel, all wound up producing. Here's what you discovered, what the memo I think corroborates-what I suspected all along was that they were doing this sort of thing, this enhanced interrogation, this torture, to people long before the legal opinion was ever asked for, and thus rendered Bybee and Yoo and by others at OCL and the Department of Justice.

So I think this corroborates that as early as May, possibly, in 2002,
they were using these techniques, and then they went to Justice and said, we have cold feet; how about giving us legal justification. Which makes what Yoo and Bybee and others did even more heinous, in my view.

The key problem with the dates is the fact that the supposed key fact extracted from Abu Zubaydah was the identify of Jose Padilla - only Padilla was arrested in may, and the memos authorizing water-boarding and harsh techniques weren't even written. until August.

This Date problem is something that was first noted in 2008 by Scott Horton in the L.A. Times.

... Yoo's account of how and why the torture memos were crafted may not hold up. Congress is preparing hearings into the subject, and they have invited Yoo to testify. International law scholar Philippe Sands and other writers have punched holes in Yoo's claims about the facts. It increasingly appears that the Bush interrogation program was already being used before Yoo was asked to write an opinion. He may therefore have provided after-the-fact legal cover. That would help explain why Yoo strained to take so many implausible positions in the memos.

In March and April Zubaydah was being interrogated largely by FBI Agent Ali Soufan, and it's long been Soufan's contention that he gained information about Padilla without using harsh techniques, although there remains ssome despute and confusion on this because Soufan wasn't theonly person interrogating Zudaydah, he was also being talked to by CIA personnel and CiA Contractors.

It was the Contractors who mistreated Zubaydah, not regular CIA personnel - at one point it got so bad Soufan nearly Arrested them.

The agent, Ali Soufan, was known as one of the bureau's top experts on Al Qaeda. He also had a reputation as a shrewd interrogator who could work fluently in both English and Arabic. Soufan yelled at one CIA contractor and told him that what he was doing was wrong, ineffective and an affront to American values. At one point, Soufan discovered a dark wooden "confinement box" that the contractor had built for Abu Zubaydah. It looked, Soufan recalls, "like a coffin." The mercurial agent erupted in anger, got on a secure phone line and called Pasquale D'Amuro, then the FBI assistant director for counterterrorism. "I swear to God," he shouted, "I'm going to arrest these guys!"

D'Amuro and other officials were alarmed at what they heard from Soufan. They fretted about the political consequences of abusive interrogations and the Washington blowback they thought was inevitable, say two high-ranking FBI sources who asked not to be identified discussing internal matters. According to a later Justice Department inspector general's report, D'Amuro warned FBI Director Bob Mueller that such activities would eventually be investigated. "Someday, people are going to be sitting in front of green felt tables having to testify about all of this," D'Amuro said, according to one of the sources.

Mueller ordered Soufan and a second FBI agent home. He then directed that bureau personnel no longer participate in CIA interrogations. In the corridors of the White House, Justice Department and U.S. intelligence agencies, heated debates ensued. Three months later, on Aug. 1, 2002, Justice lawyers issued a chilling memo blessing everything the CIA contractors had proposed—including waterboarding, or simulated drowning, a ghoulish technique that was administered to Abu Zubaydah 83 times.

So the question is did Soufan get the information as he claims, or did the contractors he nearly arrested get it - without legal authorization?

The other question is that if Zubaydah had already given up both Padilla and KSM as Soufan contends, why did they need to start using Harsh Techniques at all - unless they weren't hearing what they wanted to hear, which at the time was How is Saddam Huessein connected to al Qaeda and 9-11?"

As Wilkerson correctly points out it was the false claim that Saddam had trained al Qaeda on using WMD's actually was generated using torture from Ibn Shayk al-Libi whose confession was used to convince Colin Powell into putting on his Iraq presentation to the UN.

Soufan's primary critic has been former Bush Speechwriter Marc Thiessen who just yesterday - after reports that Padilla was arrested months before the Yoo/Bybee memos were written - appeared live at the Heritage Foundation to continue hawking his book "Courting Disaster":




I actually crashed the Live Facebook Event and posted some of the following comments/critiques as Thiessen was spouting his rhetoric: (Links and additional text added)

- OPR report confirms that information from Zubaydah about Padilla was gained *before* Water-boarding

- If we're in a "War on Terror" then yes, al Qaeda members are "Prisoners of War" and protected by Geneva - confirmed by Hamden v Rumsfeld

- Torture was banned by McCain's Detainee Treatment Act (Said in response to Thiessen claiming Obama didn't ban Torture, technically he didn't he just ordered the Army Field Manual be used by CIA in accord with the DTA)

- Waterboarding was prosecuted as a War Crime in WWII and Vietnam, this was before Reagan signed UN Convention Against Torture in 1988 & Congress passed War Crimes Act in 1993 (Thiessen contends Water-boarding isn't Torture)

- During WWII the English gained the best intelligence from Top Nazi Generals by treating them Humanely

- Thiessen Lies when he says "No one in bush Admin suggested Saddam was connected to 9-11" Bush had Habbush, head of Iraqi intelligence making that exact claim that Mohammod Atta had been trained by Saddams Intel forces (In a forged letter). Yes, I've read UNCAT & War Crimes Act. (In response to someone asking wear I earned my law degree and if I'd read the UN Convention Against Torture & War Crimes Act - I have, they're clear enough for a layman to understand, "No affronts to Personal Dignity" leaves zero wiggle room, No means "No".)

- War Crimes (Act 18 USC 2441) states "All Greavious (sic) violations of Geneva" are punishable by 5 years in prison or death (AG Gonzales was aware of this enough to argue that Bush should determine that Al Qeada and Taliban were not covered by Geneva in order to avoid being prosecuted for War Crimes. Bush signed order to this effect in Feb of 2002 - this is very likely the letter than the CIA Contractors waved in Soufan's face - "We gave the green light from Gonzales!" - they said. That Letter still didn't cover the Torture Statute (18 USC 2340) - an omission that was addressed by a Bybee memo that redefined any Torture short of Death literally out of existence - and was later overturned by Hamdan v Rumsfeld which re-guaranteed Geneva protections for All Detainees)

- Thiessen claims water-boarding KSM stopped Library Tower Plot - yet it was already stopped, whose a monster? (In response to Thiessen claiming those who oppose harsh techniques are "monstrous" because it will lead to Americans dying horribly)

- FBI Agent Ali Soufan claims he got Padillia ID from Zubaydah before Harsh Techniques, Thiessens book - which I've reviewed disputes this claiming Soufan wouldn't know since he was gone by June, but Padilla was arrested in May - how's that work?

- Kris, this isn't about the terrorist behavior, it's about our behavior under our laws and Constitution - ever heard of the 8th Amendment? (In response to commenter saying we should attack terrorists as hard as they attack us. What are we in kindergarden - "I know you are but what am I?")

- Kris, if we can just use "any available resource" why don't we just Nuke Afghanistan and Pakistan and be done with it? (Something that Yoo stated the President can do - without Congressional approval)

- The techniques Thiessen is endorsing were developed by the Communists to force compliance and gain False Political Confessions, we trained our Special Forces in S.E.R.E to resist - Bush used that training as basis for program

- Kris, Supreme Court has already established - as documented by 14th Amendment - that anyone under U.S. Jurisdictions has Equal Protection of Law, regardless of where they came from, even Terrorists see Hamdan v Rumsfeld

- What do we do? Lots of things that are all fully legal and for more effective. Look up Interrogator Matthew Alexander, who helped find and kill Zarqawi Head of Al Qaeda ni Iraq. It'll open your eyes to possibilities

It was lively debate, but it's sad to say most of them weren't up on the facts or the law. The only thing I didn't respond to during the chat was Thiessen's claim that after water-boarding KSM gave us a"Master's Class" on the inner workings of al Qaeda, yet he said during his Military commissions that after he was Tortured he just told us Stories, plus he clearly didn't lead us to Bin Laden.

Seems to me we more likely got a "Master's Class" in bullshit.

Vyan

Colin Powel: We are not "Less Safe" Under President Obama

Today on Face the Nation, Colin Powell blows a truck sized hole in the Primary Republican Meme Against President Obama being "weak" on Terrorism.



The Relevant portion of the discussion starts at 10 Minutes into the video.

"The point is made, 'We don't waterboard anymore or use extreme interrogation techniques.' Most of those extreme interrogation techniques and waterboarding were done away with in the Bush administration," Powell said. "They've been made officially done away with in this current administration."

"The Transportation Security Administration created by George Bush is still in action working in our airports; they take care of me every day that I go to an airport," Powell told moderator Bob Schieffer.

The Office of the Director of National Intelligence was also created under President Bush, "and it is still under President Obama working hard," he said. "Our counterterrorism authorities and forces are hard at work. Our law enforcement officials are hard at work. We have gone after the enemy in Afghanistan with 50,000 more troops, more predators are striking al Qaeda and Taliban leaders in Pakistan. We have continued the policies that President Bush put in place with respect to Iraq.

"The bottom line answer is the nation is still at risk. Terrorists are out there. They're trying to get through. But to suggest that somehow we have become much less safer because of the actions of the administration, I don't think that's borne out by the facts," Powell said.

The facts are the Powell is absolutely correct, most of the so-called "Enhanced Interrogation" Techniques that Dick Cheney continues to call for were Ended by the Bush Administration in 2005 after the CIA Inspector Generals Report found that they were both Illegal and Ineffective.

The real trouble began on May 7, 2004, the day the C.I.A. inspector general, John L. Helgerson, completed a devastating report. In thousands of pages, it challenged the legality of some interrogation methods, found that interrogators were exceeding the rules imposed by the Justice Department and questioned the effectiveness of the entire program.

The Torture Authorizing OLC memos by Yoo and Bybee were all recinded by 2005 - under Bush. The program was scrapped. (Although it should e noted that some elements of it were eventually revived by Bush in 2007, use of water-boarding and nudity remained off the table)

Powell goes on to note that in 8 years have only been THREE successful prosecutions under the Military Commissions system setup by Bush, two of those men, including Salin Hamdan whose Supreme Court Case effectively gutted the Commissions System and established that the Geneva Conventions Do Apply to Detainees, have already been released for time served. People in the Military Commissions still get Layers, like Hamdan's Attorney Commander Swift.

Even Military Judges have found cases untenable because the detainee Mohammad Al=Qhatani was Tortured

The idea that the only way to keep America Safe is to continue the Criminal Conspiracy of Torture that was headed and Championed by Dick Cheney - is patently ridiculous. This isn't a matter of "differences" unless you idea of a difference is a War Criminal vs NOT a War Criminal.

It's clear that Powell is still a Republican as he attempts to blame the Gridlock in Washington on the "failure to Compromise" on both sides of the aisle, as if the Democrats haven't already Compromised on Single Payer, Medicare for All and the Public Option. He suggests we should follow the example of the founding fathers on the Constitution, while ignoring that their failure to address and resolve the issue of Slavery rather than Kick the Can down the Road with clauses that prevented Congress from outlawing the importation of slaves until 1808 and ratified it's practice with the Fugitive Slave Clause led directly to the Heinous Dred Scott decision and the Civil War.

Every other Country that had Slavery ended the practice without bloodshed.

Other than that - he's pretty much on the money.

Vyan

Maher: The Tea Baggers are a CULT, not a "Movement"

He're something that crystallizes a thought I've been struggling with for a couple years now. Which is "What the FRACK is Wrong with these Neo-Con, Birther, Deather, Tenther, Seconder, Torture-Monger, Corporate Shill Nut Balls on the Right Wing of this Country?"

Maher: Their A CULT!

Well, gee that pretty much explains everything.

You can't argue with people in a Cult, because the First Rule of Cult Club is you don't trust or listen to anyone who not in Cult Club.

This is why you have them constantly talk about the "Left Wing Media" - it's not their media - so it's not to be trusted, even when the get things 100% correct.

It's not about FACT. It's not about Reality.

The World is only 4,000 Years Old. Jesus Rode a Dinosaur. Climate Change isn't true because of the Snowpocolipse in Washington, even though they have to bring in Snow by the Truck Load in Vancouver for the Winter Olympics.

Sgt Hasan is a Terrorist because his name is Hasan.

Joe Stack isn't a Terrorist because his name is Stack.

Barack Obama isn't keeping our Country safe even though he's killed or captured more terrorist in Afghanistan and Pakistan than George Bush ever dreamed of - and he's an appeaser because he won't go all Jack Bauer on the Ass-Bomber, even though we're getting plenty of actionable (and Legally useful) information from him simply by being Smarter than he is, not more Assholish!

In every way, and in every sense these guys believe a pile of shit that is completely ridiculous. It's not a difference of opinion - it's a difference of REALITY.

And it's not just the Tea Baggers, it's increasingly become more and more of the BASE of the Republican Party. That's why we can't get Health Care. That's why we can't get Financial Regulatory Reform. That's why we can't get a Job's Bill.

This is not a matter of a honest ideological differences - this is total fucking Wackjob Lunacy.

It's time we just came to recognize this for what it is and deal with it accordingly. And that is to handle it the same way that they do on Bully Beatdown.



These people aren't going to recognize reality - Until Reality (Figuratively) Hits them In the FACE!. Their Alpha Male Pit Bulls - (like Mittance Romney), Bill "Fuck it, We'll Do it Live!" O'Reilly or Glenn "Barkin Mad" Beck - don't understand anything other than POWER!





If we need to pop a cap in the Filibuster, then let's do it. If we need to use Reconciliation to pass any meaningful bills - then Let's Do it.

It's time to stop trying to be reasonable with the Unreasoned.

STOMP 'Em, Right into the Ground.

Vyan

Suicide Plane Terrorist Attack on Austin IRS Building

A plane has crashed this morning into government offices in Austin Texas including those housing the IRS. Officials are not saying they think this is an act of domestic terrorism, but they aren't saying that it was an accident either.



Via NPR

A single-engine plane crashed Thursday into an office building housing the Internal Revenue Service in Austin, Texas, in what law enforcement said could be a deliberate act by the pilot.

Local law enforcement officials and the White House, however, said they did not believe the incident was an act of terrorism. U.S. law enforcement officials said authorities were trying to determine if the pilot intentionally targeted the IRS.

What bothers me about this story is the fact that this persons own story seems to mirror my own over the past decade. He was a Contract Software Engineer, as I used to be. He ran afoul of the IRS due to unreported income, I've been practically working under the table and under the radar for that last 5 years now taking in less than $10,000 a year when I used to make an average of $45/Hr a decade ago.

I've been through bankruptcy and multi-evictions. My credit rating is destroyed. I've struggled with rage-aholism and depression. I know there are no millions of Americans who've been through something very similar.

But this guy is a long way down the road from where I am.

He railed about the Bail-outs and Health Care: Via Huffpo

Why is it that a handful of thugs and plunderers can commit unthinkable atrocities (and in the case of the GM executives, for scores of years) and when it’s time for their gravy train to crash under the weight of their gluttony and overwhelming stupidity, the force of the full federal government has no difficulty coming to their aid within days if not hours? Yet at the same time, the joke we call the American medical system, including the drug and insurance companies, are murdering tens of thousands of people a year and stealing from the corpses and victims they cripple, and this country’s leaders don’t see this as important as bailing out a few of their vile, rich cronies. Yet, the political “representatives” (thieves, liars, and self-serving scumbags is far more accurate) have endless time to sit around for year after year and debate the state of the “terrible health care problem”. It’s clear they see no crisis as long as the dead people don’t get in the way of their corporate profits rolling in.

And justice? You’ve got to be kidding!

He was more than a little cynical about "America".

That little lesson in patriotism cost me $40,000+, 10 years of my life, and set my retirement plans back to 0. It made me realize for the first time that I live in a country with an ideology that is based on a total and complete lie. It also made me realize, not only how naive I had been, but also the incredible stupidity of the American public; that they buy, hook, line, and sinker, the crap about their “freedom”... and that they continue to do so with eyes closed in the face of overwhelming evidence and all that keeps happening in front of them.

His biggest issue seemed to be a rather obscure section of the U.S. tax Code.

Return to the early ‘80s, and here I was off to a terrifying start as a ‘wet-behind-the-ears’ contract software engineer... and two years later, thanks to the fine backroom, midnight effort by the sleazy executives of Arthur Andersen (the very same folks who later brought us Enron and other such calamities) and an equally sleazy New York Senator (Patrick Moynihan), we saw the passage of 1986 tax reform act with its section 1706.

It's at the end of the note that things turn most chilling and, in my mind, 'McVeigh-ish"...

I know I’m hardly the first one to decide I have had all I can stand. It has always been a myth that people have stopped dying for their freedom in this country, and it isn’t limited to the blacks, and poor immigrants. I know there have been countless before me and there are sure to be as many after. But I also know that by not adding my body to the count, I insure nothing will change. I choose to not keep looking over my shoulder at “big brother” while he strips my carcass, I choose not to ignore what is going on all around me, I choose not to pretend that business as usual won’t continue; I have just had enough.

I can only hope that the numbers quickly get too big to be white washed and ignored that the American zombies wake up and revolt; it will take nothing less. I would only hope that by striking a nerve that stimulates the inevitable double standard, knee-jerk government reaction that results in more stupid draconian restrictions people wake up and begin to see the pompous political thugs and their mindless minions for what they are. Sadly, though I spent my entire life trying to believe it wasn’t so, but violence not only is the answer, it is the only answer. The cruel joke is that the really big chunks of shit at the top have known this all along and have been laughing, at and using this awareness against, fools like me all along.

I saw it written once that the definition of insanity is repeating the same process over and over and expecting the outcome to suddenly be different. I am finally ready to stop this insanity. Well, Mr. Big Brother IRS man, let’s try something different; take my pound of flesh and sleep well.


The communist creed: From each according to his ability, to each according to his need.

The capitalist creed: From each according to his gullibility, to each according to his greed.


Joe Stack (1956-2010)

02/18/2010

In my opinion there is no question that this was a terrorist attack against the U.S. Government. This was a Suicide Bombing via plane.

But the open question is will he be pegged as a crank from the left (with his criticism of Health Care, and "GW Bush the Puppet President"), or a crank from the right (and his rabid criticism of a currupt government and unfair taxation ala the Tea Party?) - or does his case completely fail to fit into that framing?

I doubt the right will use this to attack Obama as "Soft" on Terrorism, since there was probably no visible warning and this guys didn't have a "Muslim" name - on the other hand their likely to reject that notion that he has clear "common cause" with the Tea Party movement.

Terrorism isn't just for Muslim's anymore.

More importantly how many more people who've lost their livelihoods and all hope over the last year or last 5 years are likely to self-destruct in equally explosive ways? Or will the size of this destruction instead case them to take pause, take stock, and attempt more productive ways to help recover their sanity and in world that seems to have gone insane?

Vyan